Ok, we've all seen Say Anything, right? Who hasn't? It's a great film. We get to see one Lloyd Dobler pursue the love of the beautiful and unobtainable Diane Court. We get to see Diane Court break poor Lloyd's heart. We get to see Lloyd hold a boombox over his head playing Peter Gabriel. We see her come back to him. We see them fly off into the sunset. Ah, love.
Here's the thing that has been getting to me about Say Anything lately. I used to see Diane Court as some sort of angel. She wears the white dress to the party. She's the smartest girl in school. She's sweet. She's cute. What's not to love about this Diane Court girl? She's the best. Well, I'll tell you something, folks. I'm just not buying it anymore. I'm starting to think that maybe, just maybe, this Diane Court character is a whore. I never noticed earlier in life, but it's clear as day if you just know what to look for. She shows her whorish ways throughout the film. Cameron Crowe drops hints left and right, but I guess I just didn't catch them because she and Lloyd are just so darn cute. Well, I now believe Diane Court is no less of a slut than a character from one of Crowe's later works, Almost Famous. That's right, I am saying Diane was putting it out there just as much as the notorious "Band aid", Penny Lane.
What's worse, Penny never tried to act like she was anything else. Diane Court is lying to us. She acts all innocent. She's even worried about being perceived as a "priss". In fact, she's far worse than Penny, and I aim to prove it. That's the goal here. To point out all the little hints that Crowe gives us about Diane Court's past. And to scream at Lloyd to wear a condom. The only way I know to do this is to watch the only evidence we have of said relationship. So here goes nothing, an in depth look at Say Anything and the whoring ways of Diane Court.
(Note: I would like to apologize in advance to James Court and Lloyd Dobler. Jim, I'm not attacking the way you raised your daughter. It's tough being a single dad. You did everything you could to give Diane every advantage in life. You were so busy stealing money from old ladies and hiding it from the IRS, how were you to know your daughter was out blowing college sophomores on dollar beer night? On top of that, your ex wife is clearly a cougar and I can't help but think part of that rubbed off on your daughter no matter how you hard you worked to lessen her influence on Diane. Jim, please don't shank me. Lloyd,you and Diane, if you're still together, have been together for twenty years now, so I'm sure you know all of this. Let me be the first to congratulate you on your ability to turn a ho into a housewife. You're a great guy and deserve everything you want. I just have a feeling that you're not with Diane anymore. She probably slept with her professors in England. Then she left you for some dude that actually made money instead of following his dreams as a kickboxer. Seriously, Lloyd? Kickboxing? Sport of the future? Anyway... Sorry.)
Alright, I got my beverage handy and the dvr is ready to play. Let's do this...
As anyone who's seen this movie before it starts with Lloyd discussing his plans to go out with Diane Court again. His friends, Corey and DC, tell him this is a bad idea. Diane Court is out of his league. He's only going to get hurt. Lloyd then proclaims, "I wanna get hurt!" Well, strap in Lloyd, cause it's going to be a bumpy ride.
Next we're introduced to Diane and James Court. They are on the way to graduation and Diane is running through her speech. It's at this point that we find out two very important things about the young Ms. Court. We find out she has a very, shall we say, "interesting" relationship with her father. I'm just saying, that's a little weird. Second, we learn that Diane was "taking a few courses at the university this year." Oh, really? I find that interesting. A 18 year old high school senior was taking classes at the university? I wonder what was going on with all that? More on that later.
"We're going to remember this student who said, 'Hey, world, check me out." Not really important. Speech bombs. Let's move forward.
The next interesting little tidbit we pick up is when Lloyd calls Diane the first time. Jim answers the phone and asks Lloyd if he's "the guy with the Mustang... the guy with the Datsun... um, the truck?" Jesus, how many dudes is this chick running through? It sounds like he's running a damn used car lot over there. Then he says, "Why I just get a phone number from you, that's usually how it works?" "Usually how it works." What the hell does that mean, Jim? What kind of numbers are we talking about here? Is it in the hundreds? I'm just saying. You should have known right then and there, Lloyd. Run!!!
I would make some crack about how she got that fellowship, but I'll leave it alone. I mean, I just heard her speech. She's not the best in the country. I'm just saying. I'm not going to judge her though. You gotta do what you gotta do. Anyway, that's not covered in the movie, so I'll let it go.
I'll give her credit. She calls back. That's very sweet. I'll also say that Lloyd can be quite a charmer. It's interesting to note she doesn't even remember eating with him. Lloyd fights through her initial jitters and gets her to commit to going out with a guy who just graduated from high school. Way to go, Lloyd. A+ work, my man.
So, Lloyd picks her up. We see the infamous white dress. Whoa, indeed Lloyd. It appears as though you may have bitten off a little more than you can chew to me. Jim Court is shocked by Lloyd's appearance. Lloyd is not the normal frat guy she goes out with and blows on the way home. Lloyd is actually a good guy. A good guy with no future, but a good guy none the less.
Nothing really telling happens at the party. Mike Cameron is one of the greatest characters ever in cinema. Joe is a jerk. Jeremy Piven shows the promise that will lead him to greatness later in life. Lloyd is a super nice guy. Which only makes it worse when Diane inevitably breaks his heart. Whore!!!!
"I've never really gone out with basic as you." That's what she says to Lloyd at the end of the date. Really? That's the best you could come up with? Go back to blowing college sophomores on Saturday night after the game. Keep your filthy hands of Lloyd!!!!
Apparently, Diane is a screamer...
Next we meet Diane's mother. She wants to talk about boys. That's all she wants. Granted, Diane tries to change the subject. That being said, Diane shares half this cougar's DNA. Keep that in mind.
Scenes of them hanging out... yada. yada. yada.
And here it comes... Back seat of Lloyd's car. It's happening. Give it to her, Lloyd!!! You can do it!!!!At this point you notice a couple things. Lloyd asks, "Are you comfortable?" Diane says, "Yes." Of course she is. She's been in a lot of backseats. She tries to calm him down. She's been through the drill. "Listen to this song. It's a really good song." She knows how to get what she wants. I am on to you, Diane Court. Where did you learn that move? The fraternity formal last Christmas? She bags Lloyd.
So, then Diane comes home. This time she tries to sneak in, and Jim is pissed. So, she tells him where she was. She slept with him. Now, it's important to notice the look on his face. He even ask, "Lloyd?" As though maybe it could have been someone else. Could there have been? Were there other dudes lurking around the house with boomboxes? Was it the guy with the Mustang? The Datsun? We don't know, but this is not the reaction of a man who's daughter is going through her first rodeo. This is the reaction of a man who's seen some shit. This is the reaction of a man who has maybe had to pay for an abortion or two. I'm just saying. The guy is not shocked. He's more pissed at who and not what. It's as though if she would say, "You know, Jack? The one with the truck? Well, I ran into him last night and we hooked up..." then everything would have been ok. She adds that she thought about not sleeping with him and then she "attacked him anyway." These are not the words of a woman who doesn't know what she's doing. She basically goes through the birds and the bees with her dad as though he doesn't know, cause she knows them very well. She knows them very well.
Lloyd has that I just got laid talk with the ladies. Enjoy it Lloyd. It's all down here from here. You're toast. It's over.
So, here it comes. Jim does not think Lloyd is good enough for her. He isn't like the frat guys she hates, but he has no future and she'll be working at an "international think tank".(Side note: Do people wish for this for their kids? He doesn't say she's going to be a doctor or a lawyer or a Senator. Working an international thing tank? Really, Jim.) He says to break up with him. Give him a pen. She says she'd never do that. We'll see.
They're driving around. Talking and more talking. Lloyd says he loves her. She says she doesn't want to go to this level. What the hell? (BTW, Lloyd keep your eyes on the road.) She's trying to break up with him. He hasn't realized... and...then... boom... he figures it out. She just broke up with him. She says, "We shared the most intimate thing two people can share." My only question is, how many times have you used that line? She tells him "I love you." I put quotes around it because she does air quotes when she says it. She gives him the pen... she gives him the pen.
She gave him the pen!!!!
Now, I ask you, what kind of person does something like this? Lloyd gave her his heart, she gave him a pen. What the hell is wrong with this person? What kind of demented things go on in their mind? What else do you want someone to do, Diane? Oh, they show her crying. Great. Like I care if she's crying. She just broke Lloyd's heart. She's dead to me.
Lloyd drives around the city remembering the places they did things. Anyone who has ever loved anyone knows this feeling. What is Diane doing? We don't know. Probably out at some frat party with some new dude. I'm just guessing. She's out with some dude with a fake tan and a popped collar. You know the type. She'll hook up with him and say it was a "mistake". That's what they do. Meanwhile, Lloyd is hanging out with Joe and gang at the Gas and Sip. "Bitches, man!!" says some kid that's there. Agreed. "Bitches, man."
"I draw the line at seven unreturned phone calls." he says. That seems reasonable. I mean here he is dying. The phone works both ways. His friends convince him to call her again. So, he calls again and leaves a very long and desperate sounding message. Pick up the damn phone, woman!!! She is made of stone. Lloyd is dying and she cannot answer the phone. Whore!!!!
This guy doesn't quit!!! I gotta give it to him. I mean on the scale of crazy crap to do to win back a woman, playing Peter Gabriel on a ghetto blaster outside her house at dawn has gotta be one of the nuttier things I've ever heard of. It's just this side of breaking and entering. People call the cops for less, but Lloyd just stands there and does it. What no one seems to talk about is, what you never hear about when people talk about that scene is she doesn't even acknowledge him. She doesn't even come to the window, much less go outside an talk to the poor guy. In the next scene she ask for the IRS guy to be decent and talk to her about her dad. Oh, that's rich coming from you. You got a guy who may very well kill himself at any moment and you can't even answer a damn phone or come to a window. Be a little decent, Diane.
And here she comes!!! She finds out her dad is a cheat and a liar and she comes crawling back. Don't take her back, Lloyd. You'll only encourage this type of behavior in the future. At least make her sweat it out a little. I know, it's easier said than done, but come on man. Don't just let her walk right back in. Ahh, it hopeless.
And that's it. He let's her back in. They go visit her dad in prison and they fly to England together. It works out. Or so they say. I used to believe that... when I was 17. Maybe, I should still believe that, but I don't. Women who do those types of things will do them again. She'll continue to walk all over Lloyd for the rest of their relationship. She'll never respect him. She may love him, but she'll never respect him. Good luck with that, Lloyd. Just don't say I, and the kid from the gas and sip, didn't warn you...
"Bitches, man."
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13 comments:
That's it? Really? Diane's a whore? Although that may be the case (and I guess thanks for pointing it out), I don't really think it's earth shattering stuff here.
I'll go one step further and say poor Cameron has never (except one maybe) written a lead female character accurately. He writes his lead females not how women really are. My only exception is Jennifer Jason Leigh's character, Stacy, in Fast Times. And really, the only reason he got her right for the most part is he did loads of on site recon (as like a twenty something) posing as a high schooler before he wrote that one. That's it. Name another realistic lead female character that he's written, I dare you. Singles? Nope. Vanilla Sky? Nope. Rene in Jerry Mcguire? Nope. Come on. And by the way, Dunst in Elizabethtown is the worst one...so unrealistic.
That's it? Jesus, half my readers won't read anything longer than a paragraph and you want more? As far as earth shattering goes... the fact that Aerosmith was better before they quit drugs isn't earth shattering. Most people wouldn't consider Diane Court a whore. Anyone with ears knows Aerosmith was better on drugs.
Well, if you know my opinion of women, clearly I'd say Diane Court is as real as they come.
"That's it?" refers to your main argument not your method which was very much in the style of the lengthy u2clay.
In either extreme case, angel or whore regarding Diane, Cameron can't write lead women roles, which to me is more of a conversation starter as I think Cameron's early work, Fast Times, is his best and he's gotten worse over time. Takes living among high schoolers (for him) to write about them accurately.
As far as the post, I felt like I just read an argument about whether or not the stuff that comes out of our asses is shit or poop. Whatever you call it (angel or whore), I'm not putting it between two pieces of bread and eating it.
"I just can't have any social life right now."
"Everything else means nothing to me. If I hurt you again, I'll die."
Jesus, that's some award winning Tarantio stuff there ;) And this is from the same guy who wrote
"You had me at hello," for Rene and "You complete me," for Tom. Really? Do people really talk that way? Normally he gets the guys right but in "Jerry" he manages to make Tom's character unbelievable. (I'm also thinking that Cuba did a lot of script doctoring to his lines in that one but that's for another day...)
So, you making an observation, that I don't even agree with and that thousands of film critics have made, and it is "earth shattering". I'm sorry you think 18 year old women are more complicated than Diane Court. In my experience, even the older ones aren't. Granted I don't have the experience with women you do, but I'm just saying it speaks to me, and I think that's the point. I wasn't trying to do a rundown of all of Cameron Crowe's female characters. Once again, you've tried to make this into an academic study. It's a fucking joke, man.
Drogba never thought of Diane as a whore but that could very much be the case. Drogba's problem was always with Lloyd. We are suppose to believe that Lloyd is a kickboxer? Yeah right, he's not "HARD" enough to be a kickboxer. A real kickboxer would have dropped the whore once he got what he wanted and moved on. Drogba thinks Lloyd probably got his ASS handed to him the first time he tried to fight a real kickboxer and the he moved on to teaching spin class at the local YMCA, never to be with an "experienced" woman like Diane again.
Drogba pretty much skips over Diane and goes on to talk about Lloyd. I say stick with the usless observations on "bacon"...much funnier if you're going for the "it's a fucking joke" thing.
Drogba can speak to what Drogba wishes to speak. Attack my work if you must, but lay off the Drogba. As far as it not being funny... well, we'll just disagree on that. I think someone taking the time to think about the sexual activity of a fictional character from a 20 year old film is funny. You would rather wonder whether or not said character is a realistic depiction of this idea you have of women. That is fine, I suggest you write about it. I look forward to reading about it on your extremely entertaining film blog. I think she is realistic. That's why I think she was giving bjs out in the bathroom of those frat parties. I find the character is believable... I believe she's a whore!!!
As far as Diane is concerned, she may very well be a whore. Drogba can see what Evil is talking about. That being said, Drogba thinks she does a damn good job of hiding the fact that she's a whore. Drogba has been with some "fast" women in his day and they usually have a way about themselves and Diane does a fine job of hiding her whorish ways, in Drogba's opinion.
what i believe: "whore/angel" useless? yes. "whore angel" worthy of a post? no.
just because your view of diane could be different than most:
a. doesn't make it funny
b. isn't really all that different (that's why it's not earth shattering) because i would say most viewers don't think she was an angel (just because she spoke at grad and wears a white dress) to begin with anyway. which makes the idea of her being a whore not as drastic.
c. she was (badly) written to be out of lloyd's (and others') league...not as an angel or a whore
d. the idea that she has to be an angel or a whore is stupid. but i guess this is how you view all women in movies???
and as far as me writing about "said character" fitting my defintion of what i believe a woman is:
1. not that interesting to write about.
2. you've already said 1000's others have said what i've said in that cameron can't write lead women roles so why would i waste time on my film blog when i could point out the absurdity of arguing over the nature (angel/whore) of a very badly written female lead character on your blog?
also, no crack on drogba here. he fo reel!
I guess my point is that you keep approaching this as a film critic. I'm not trying to be a film critic. I'll leave that to you. I am approaching this as a guy who watched this little whore break Lloyd's heart.
If you want to read reviews of Say Anything, they are available, you've pretty much provided one here. I am not doing that. I am sticking up for a nice guy and calling Diane Court out for what she is.
"Bitches, Man"
Finally went back and watch Say Anything the other day...here's what I got as far as analyzing Evil's argument that Diane's a whore:
Other students at Diane’s high school think Diane is a “brain trapped in the body of a game show hostess.”
-Game show hostesses can be a little whorish so I’ll give Evil that.
Lloyd’s friends (and high school students with Diane) say “brains stay with brains”
-students at her school think she’s a brain…now Diane could be fooling those high school students but who knows…there’s no proof she's a whore.
She took courses at a college campus
-Evil points out that possibilities could happen on a college campus that would lead some to believe that she could be a whore, but just because a high school student takes classes at a college campus doesn’t mean she’s whore…I think most would think she’s smart and a bit of a "brain" for even being allowed to take classes at a college as a high school student. I don’t think college admissions people just let in any high school student who is extremely smart to take classes early at a college without checking out if she could handle it socially.
Diane thinks everyone at school thinks she’s a priss
-again, she maybe fooling her fellow high school students but I doubt it
Her dad knows of at least 3 guys who drive three different automobiles who have called on Diane: Mustang, Datson, truck
-now I don’t know how Diane could get out of high school without going on at least 3 different dates sometime in her high school life…let’s just say for simplicity: Senior Year Homecoming, Senior Year Winter Formal and Senior Year Prom…there are your three dates with three different cars without even including Junior Year.
Lloyd says: “Diane, everybody loved that you showed up.”
-implying that she doesn’t show up to parties involving students she goes to school with…not very whorish of her at least with her high school friends. maybe she is a whore at college or maybe she has friends at other high schools or who are not in high school…who knows…but throughout the movie, we never see or hear her talk about having any other friends...maybe she just studies a lot?...brain by day, whore by night?
Diane said after the party to Lloyd about what people said to her:
“glad I finally met you. You always seem nice”
“wish I could have known you more”
Lloyd’s response:
“they knew of you, now they know you”
Diane’s response
“now I feel like I fit in more”
-since when do 18 year old whores want to fit in more with their high school friends? I don't know any 18 year old whores, but I just don't think they would think this way...we can always ask Evil.
-Diane says, “I’ve never gone out with someone as basic as you.”
-implying that she’s dated at least one more nonessential or secondary person in the past...but it doesn’t really prove that she’s a whore…maybe those three guys who drive the Mustang, Datsun and Truck are less basic than Lloyd.
There was a weird hug after their 1st date
-not very whore like if you ask me, but again I'm not an expert in whores...that's a matter to ask Evil about (how do whores hug on a first date) since he's making the accusation.
MORE IN THE FOLLOWING COMMENT...
Dad expects her to call at some point ever night that she’s out late
-she always calls...is that whore like for an 18 year old girl to always call her Dad no matter what, when or where she is…takes a really cunning or crafty person to call one’s Dad as she’s out all night whoring around.
Diane: “I spent the night with him.” Dad: “Lloyd?”
-implying that there were/are others that she COULD have spent the night with but because he had to ask, it sounds as if she never told him about the others (if there were any others)…not very whore like if you ask me.
Diane’s scared of what her dad thinks about her sleeping with Lloyd
-implying that she’s never told her dad that she’s slept with anyone in the past and if their relationship is such that she can tell him anything, why is it now that she’s tell him this if she had been whoring around before? If it’s only because she actually likes Lloyd but she didn’t like the others, I don’t buy it…I though they have an open kind of relationship as Evil hinted at early in his post.
Dad says, “He’s nothing like these frat kids you can’t stand.”
-helps Evil’s argument out a little bit in that this implies that she knows of frat kids that she doesn’t like…but why would Diane hang out (or continue to hang out) with people she doesn’t like…
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